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National Team Pursuit / Olympic Sprint poll
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Do you think that composite teams (made up from riders that are first claim members of different cycling clubs) should be allowed to race in the Team Pursuit / Team Sprint events in the National Championships?
Yes
16%
 16%  [ 13 ]
No
71%
 71%  [ 55 ]
Not really fussed!
11%
 11%  [ 9 ]
Total Votes : 77

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Joel
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 3:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joel Stewart, agiskoviner votes NO
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John McC
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Emyr42 wrote:
"Not fussed"

I'm not likely to medal with my team or in a composite, so it doesn't really matter who I get beaten by so long as I see some good fast racing.

Emyr Derfel, CC Cardiff

Perhaps you could view this matter on principle, and not from the viewpoint of personal gain.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Leigh Haigh - Victoria CC

Voted - NO
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

James Varnish No.

I think there is scope for two levels of national event and it takes away the chance of clubs working together to build the teams.

J
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

could the people who have voted yes put their names up as well? willi won't count your votes if you don't put your names up

Laughing Laughing what am i saying? as if.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alan Peet VC St Raphael -No
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

John McC wrote:
Emyr42 wrote:
"Not fussed"

I'm not likely to medal with my team or in a composite, so it doesn't really matter who I get beaten by so long as I see some good fast racing.

Emyr Derfel, CC Cardiff

Perhaps you could view this matter on principle, and not from the viewpoint of personal gain.


Quote:
so long as I see some good fast racing.


Rolling Eyes

Yes, if I was in the situation of being capable of medalling, I might be annoyed... but it's sport, you play by the rules as they are until they're changed, then you play by new rules.
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yasumitsudan
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 3:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan Woolfenden - Schlapp - No

i can see both sides of the arguement though, but still think no.
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John McC
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Emyr42 wrote:
Yes, if I was in the situation of being capable of medalling, I might be annoyed... but it's sport, you play by the rules as they are until they're changed, then you play by new rules.

So one is only allowed to have a negative opinion of a rule if it has a direct bearing on one's medal chances. So much for principle. Rolling Eyes
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Last edited by John McC on Thu Oct 12, 2006 4:12 pm; edited 3 times in total
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello for those that don't know me my name is Brian Evans Agiskoviner.

Computer says NO.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I voted no but I think it is a pity that some have had a go at the WCPP team or riders when they were complying within the existing rules and I am sure only rode to support British track racing and "the nationals" - many people must have loved seeing the "stars" ride. I can't believe they need the competition as, for example, I heard that the British juniors (or was it the Under 23's?) rode 120 team pursuits in practice before the worlds.

I think this matter could be easily resolved by the WCPP riders continuing to ride all the individual events and - for the team events - perhaps ride as a demonstratation race where they in effect do a "private time". That way the medals would go to "real" teams and riders from all over UK could still say they had tested themselves against the best riders in the world in a unique atmosphere.

Finally spare a thought for Willi - who I have never met - and think of all the effort he went to to organise what seems to have been a highly successful national championships. He seems to be coming in for a lot of flak which I think is a shame.


Last edited by De Rosa on Mon Jun 04, 2007 7:07 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

De Rosa wrote:
Guy Elliott - Solihull CC.

I voted no but I think it is a pity that some have had a go at the WCPP team or riders


tbh honest I don't think anyone has have they?
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Billy Boy wrote:
De Rosa wrote:
Guy Elliott - Solihull CC.

I voted no but I think it is a pity that some have had a go at the WCPP team or riders


tbh honest I don't think anyone has have they?


Well I thought they had but maybe I am muddled as there are so many posts on this! Wink Shocked Wink
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Billynobrakes
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

De Rosa wrote:
Guy Elliott - Solihull CC.

I voted no but I think it is a pity that some have had a go at the WCPP team or riders when they were complying within the existing rules and I am sure only rode to support British track racing and "the nationals" - many people must have loved seeing the "stars" ride. I can't believe they need the competition as, for example, I heard that the British juniors (or was it the Under 23's?) rode 120 team pursuits in practice before the worlds.

I think this matter could be easily resolved by the WCPP riders continuing to ride all the individual events and - for the team events - perhaps ride as a demonstratation race where they in effect do a "private time". That way the medals would go to "real" teams and riders from all over UK could still say they had tested themselves against the best riders in the world in a unique atmosphere.

Finally spare a thought for Willi - who I have never met - and think of all the effort he went to to organise what seems to have been a highly successful national championships. He seems to be coming in for a lot of flak which I think is a shame.


Hi Guy

TBH no-one has had a go at the WCPP riders, they've just done what they were told - it's the rule people have a problem with, not the riders.

As for Willi, any flak he's come in for I'm afraid is of his own making on this one. I wouldn't want to take anything away from the great job he does in organising the nationals but his attitude throughout this whole debate has been one of bloody mindedness sometimes bordering on rudeness and personal insult - what do you expect in response?
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De Rosa
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Billynobrakes wrote:
De Rosa wrote:
Guy Elliott - Solihull CC.

I voted no but I think it is a pity that some have had a go at the WCPP team or riders when they were complying within the existing rules and I am sure only rode to support British track racing and "the nationals" - many people must have loved seeing the "stars" ride. I can't believe they need the competition as, for example, I heard that the British juniors (or was it the Under 23's?) rode 120 team pursuits in practice before the worlds.

I think this matter could be easily resolved by the WCPP riders continuing to ride all the individual events and - for the team events - perhaps ride as a demonstratation race where they in effect do a "private time". That way the medals would go to "real" teams and riders from all over UK could still say they had tested themselves against the best riders in the world in a unique atmosphere.

Finally spare a thought for Willi - who I have never met - and think of all the effort he went to to organise what seems to have been a highly successful national championships. He seems to be coming in for a lot of flak which I think is a shame.


Hi Guy

TBH no-one has had a go at the WCPP riders, they've just done what they were told - it's the rule people have a problem with, not the riders.

As for Willi, any flak he's come in for I'm afraid is of his own making on this one. I wouldn't want to take anything away from the great job he does in organising the nationals but his attitude throughout this whole debate has been one of bloody mindedness sometimes bordering on rudeness and personal insult - what do you expect in response?


Thanks.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adrian Trott - No
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 6:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As an interim summary, it is fairly one sided at present!

There are quite a few who have obviously been observing the previous threads who are now able to show which side of the fence (or on it) they sit.

Just to reiterate, you HAVE to make sure your club pushes up this matter to your region, so it can go to the National council agenda, so it can be presented, reviewed and answered.

I'd still like to see a Glendene representative on here, as they have lost the most IMHO in the last 2 years by this situation being allowed to happen.

Willi, do you have any comments about who thinks what now?
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John Saysell
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PCA Ciclos Uno - No.
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George Gilbert
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 8:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

George Gilbert - Personal opinion is that all the National Championships are *open* events. They are not club only events and therefore entries should not be restricted to clubs only.

So, on principle, I vote yes.

Also, I think that the rules should be consistent for all the team races (Team Pursuit / Team Sprint / Madison / Derny etc) - as well as allowing composites in all these events they should all also be identified in the same way. For example, I think all teams should be called by the names of the riders or the list of clubs the riders are first claim members of (e.g. "Glendene / Recycling" rather than "Composite X").
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Billynobrakes
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 8:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gary K wrote:
Just to reiterate, you HAVE to make sure your club pushes up this matter to your region, so it can go to the National council agenda, so it can be presented, reviewed and answered.


Gary I've tried to get this started, I've Emailed the Regional 'man' and will do everything I can to get this pushed forward in my region and would urge others to do the same in their regions if they feel strongly about this.
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