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Hypothetical cycle lane question
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JONNO
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PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2010 1:47 pm    Post subject: Hypothetical cycle lane question Reply with quote

Discussion at work today I couldn't answer, You are riding at the same speed as the traffic and the twit one car in front decides to throw a left without indicating, you can't stop and end up hitting the car and sprawled across the road. Is it 50/50 or what?
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Fritz
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PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2010 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought they would be 100% liable if he makes a manouvre and hits you. Certainly that is the case in Europe and if you are on your bike as the car is automatically liable.
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Rob of the Og
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PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2010 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That question was very much on my mind as I rode down Marylebone Rd and Euston Rd into the office this morning... presumably they've cut across your lane and are entirely responsible. Is it any different to if someone tried to dive over from the outside lane of a motorway to the slip road and took a few people out on the way?
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mattr
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PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2010 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IIRC it depends on the road markings.

If you've got a solid line that then becomes broken over the junction, the driver is at fault. As you are a proper separate lane with "rights".

If its a broken line that disappears over the junction, its your fault.

Its years since i've ever even bothered looking at this (a mate got hit in a dotted line cycle path, so we did some digging.)

Obv. there are other factors that the driver will use to try and get off. You didn't have lights/reflective vest/helmet/reflectors/body armour etc etc.
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JONNO
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PostPosted: Tue May 04, 2010 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The other one that gets to me is the idiots using side roads as rat runs then pulling straight out across the cycle lane at speed before stopping, to try and push their way in to the traffic. I know they WOULD be liable in an accident but it's not much consolation if your hurt by them.
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Zarate
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's a bus + cycle lane nearby on a main road, which has clear signs on it warning left turning traffic that they HAVE to check before turning across it for a left exit. Mind, being hit be a bus is less appealing than simply taking out an innocent bike rider. But surely the same principle applies?
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key ran
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

assume that not indicating wouldn't help his case for 50/50?

I have gone over a car (slowly moving in a traffic jam) when passing on the inside and the car suddenly decides to do a left without indicating just as I was passing. The bike was damaged, not me, anyway the driver's insurers paid up with very little fuss.
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olamba
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 7:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ride with the assumption that most drivers will do the unexpected & then be pleasantly surprised if they see you.

did you know that if there is a double white line down the middle of the road, & there is more than 1 cyclist, then you CANNOT pass (in a car obv.)? came up on my ADI course.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 7:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

olamba wrote:
did you know that if there is a double white line down the middle of the road, & there is more than 1 cyclist, then you CANNOT pass (in a car obv.)? came up on my ADI course.


I think you mean MUST NOT.
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Chrissylaa
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Legs wrote:
olamba wrote:
did you know that if there is a double white line down the middle of the road, & there is more than 1 cyclist, then you CANNOT pass (in a car obv.)? came up on my ADI course.


I think you mean MUST NOT.


I think the correct phrase is :shall not.
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olamba
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Legs wrote:
olamba wrote:
did you know that if there is a double white line down the middle of the road, & there is more than 1 cyclist, then you CANNOT pass (in a car obv.)? came up on my ADI course.


I think you mean MUST NOT.


i'll write it out a 100 times Smile
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Roy Gardiner
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 7:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

olamba wrote:
did you know that if there is a double white line down the middle of the road, & there is more than 1 cyclist, then you CANNOT pass (in a car obv.)? came up on my ADI course.
Even if you don't cross the double white line?
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olamba
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 7:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roy Gardiner wrote:
olamba wrote:
did you know that if there is a double white line down the middle of the road, & there is more than 1 cyclist, then you CANNOT pass (in a car obv.)? came up on my ADI course.
Even if you don't cross the double white line?


that's a judgement call... & sadly a likely scenario
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Chrissylaa
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 7:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roy Gardiner wrote:
olamba wrote:
did you know that if there is a double white line down the middle of the road, & there is more than 1 cyclist, then you CANNOT pass (in a car obv.)? came up on my ADI course.
Even if you don't cross the double white line?


Good one. Cool
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John McC
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Roy Gardiner wrote:
olamba wrote:
did you know that if there is a double white line down the middle of the road, & there is more than 1 cyclist, then you CANNOT pass (in a car obv.)? came up on my ADI course.
Even if you don't cross the double white line?

The line does not need to be double, but solid on your side only.
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John McC
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Des wrote:
If he moved from the centre lane of the motorway into the nearside lane without looking or indicating, he would be liable, so the same should apply here.

Deleted due to avatar abuse.
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Zarate
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just had a refresher look at the Highway Code, it says you can cross a solid line to pass a parked vehicle, or a slow moving vehicle (doing less than 10mph), provided no-one else is coming and forced to slow or alter course. Otherwise you wait. And every day that little bit of legislation is ignored. Maybe because 99% of drivers haven't looked at HC since the test was passed, and if they did would ignore it anyway, if it impeded their ability to rush about, in the slightest way.
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TBK
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 12:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

observer wrote:
Just had a refresher look at the Highway Code, it says you can cross a solid line to pass a parked vehicle, or a slow moving vehicle (doing less than 10mph), provided no-one else is coming and forced to slow or alter course. Otherwise you wait. And every day that little bit of legislation is ignored. Maybe because 99% of drivers haven't looked at HC since the test was passed, and if they did would ignore it anyway, if it impeded their ability to rush about, in the slightest way.


The 10 mph bit has been in for about 7 or 8 years, the reason for it being put in was to allow the overtaking of slow moving cyclists and horses.

mattr wrote:
If you've got a solid line that then becomes broken over the junction, the driver is at fault. As you are a proper separate lane with "rights".


I've been hit by a 17 year old girl who pulled straight across a cycle lane into a petrol station forecourt, everything caught on camera so her and passengers protestations that she had indicated and wasn't on phone went up in smoke when the police saw the film. She got 6 points, lost licence for 6 months and will have to redo test too. She should have looked and been payng attention. Still waiting for payout from insurance company to sort my frame, they don't understand why it will cost quite so much and why I won't take their alternative!
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Zarate
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TBK wrote:
observer wrote:
Just had a refresher look at the Highway Code, it says you can cross a solid line to pass a parked vehicle, or a slow moving vehicle (doing less than 10mph), provided no-one else is coming and forced to slow or alter course. Otherwise you wait. And every day that little bit of legislation is ignored. Maybe because 99% of drivers haven't looked at HC since the test was passed, and if they did would ignore it anyway, if it impeded their ability to rush about, in the slightest way.


The 10 mph bit has been in for about 7 or 8 years, the reason for it being put in was to allow the overtaking of slow moving cyclists and horses.

mattr wrote:
If you've got a solid line that then becomes broken over the junction, the driver is at fault. As you are a proper separate lane with "rights".


I've been hit by a 17 year old girl who pulled straight across a cycle lane into a petrol station forecourt, everything caught on camera so her and passengers protestations that she had indicated and wasn't on phone went up in smoke when the police saw the film. She got 6 points, lost licence for 6 months and will have to redo test too. She should have looked and been payng attention. Still waiting for payout from insurance company to sort my frame, they don't understand why it will cost quite so much and why I won't take their alternative!


So, a result so far as a daft driver is concerned (I'll bet daddy wasn't too happy!), and keep bashing away at teh insurance company - any injuries compensation as well?
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JimmyRay
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Going back to the start... I think the key point is that the driver was not indicating.

If a dotted cycle lane, would there be an argument that the driver hadn't successfully overtaken you before turning.. I'd have thought that would need to be a factor and its not just a case of you as a cyclist having to be able to stop in teh distance you are trailing...

if that was the case than surely the easiest way to make a fraudulent claim would be to overtake cars and then rapidly turn left with teh anchors on... money ahoy!
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