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| Total Votes : 59 |
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the shadowy darkforces
E, Bronze
Joined: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 279
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 Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2007 8:52 pm Post subject: Should d r u g s be l e g a l i s e d? |
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| making a deal with the devil or another way to make the sport clean |
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Patrick
Div 3 Pro
Joined: 02 May 2005
Posts: 3974
Location: Royston Vasey
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| Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2007 8:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Mods, delete this thread please. |
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Tucker
Tour Winner
Joined: 03 May 2006
Posts: 15722
Location: Swindon
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| Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2007 8:56 pm Post subject: |
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| No - testing means that cyclists are less likely to do serious harm to themselves i.e. they have to keep their consumption "moderate" to still beat the tests. Tom Simpson said "if it takes 10 to kill me, give me 9", an attitude I have no doubt is shared by many professional cyclists. |
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the shadowy darkforces
E, Bronze
Joined: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 279
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| Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2007 9:06 pm Post subject: |
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| yeah, think they would really hit it hard if there was no short term risks |
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IainW
E, Silver
Joined: 27 May 2003
Posts: 1996
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| Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2007 10:08 pm Post subject: |
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and when do you start juicing them? which parents are going to stick the needles in the under 8's  Would you do it to your kids?
effin stupid post!
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Patrick
Div 3 Pro
Joined: 02 May 2005
Posts: 3974
Location: Royston Vasey
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| Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2007 10:44 pm Post subject: |
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| IainW wrote: |
and when do you start juicing them? which parents are going to stick the needles in the under 8's Would you do it to your kids?
effin stupid post!
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Ditto.
Delete.
And finally, how the hell can a sport be made 'clean' be allowing 'd r u g s?
So not only is this a pointless thread, but it doesn't make any sense either. |
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Zeco2
E, Gold
Joined: 10 Feb 2005
Posts: 2190
Location: Prickwillow
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| Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2007 10:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Patrick wrote: |
| Mods, delete this thread please. |
Apparently Socrates was obliged to take poison because his views didn't coincide with those of the day. I suppose deletion of one's thread might just be considered a preferable fate? 
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The British Monarchy = Institutionalised Privilage |
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p*bongo
E, Silver
Joined: 27 May 2004
Posts: 1202
Location: In the woods with the bears
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| Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2007 10:52 pm Post subject: |
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Yea but no but.... its being deleted anyway!
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david123
E, Silver
Joined: 11 Apr 2007
Posts: 1868
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 12:42 am Post subject: |
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Someone asks a question to which he would like an answer, others dont want this to happen for whatever reason, the reason not being supplied except in a sideways fashion by one of the "Disgustified of Tunbridge Wails". If we are to censor questioners in this fashion we might as well all go and get our coats ,Oh I get it , its a joke, but please tell me whos telling it. Hints of Maily Dale here wudnt u think.
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mattr
World Champ
Joined: 16 Apr 2004
Posts: 12647
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 5:54 am Post subject: |
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| Patrick wrote: |
And finally, how the hell can a sport be made 'clean' be allowing 'd r u g s?
So not only is this a pointless thread, but it doesn't make any sense either. |
you don't follow many other sports do you, many make the sport clean by ignoring the problem, effectively what has been suggested here.
I disagree, they should remain banned, but it is a valid point. |
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Tucker
Tour Winner
Joined: 03 May 2006
Posts: 15722
Location: Swindon
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 6:00 am Post subject: |
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| Patrick wrote: |
And finally, how the hell can a sport be made 'clean' be allowing 'd r u g s?
So not only is this a pointless thread, but it doesn't make any sense either. |
Firstly, the author made no mention of the word clean.
However, there is a very easy answer to your question. Cycling is "dirty" because riders take banned drugs. If no drugs were banned, then cycling would be clean. Simple eh? |
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Roy Gardiner
T de F Winner
Joined: 14 Jul 2003
Posts: 21249
Location: London and Essex
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 6:30 am Post subject: |
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I'm not going to delete this thread.
- In sport, drugs must not be legalised.
- In real life, drugs must be legalised.
Good 'ere innit?
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kb7
E, Bronze
Joined: 01 Apr 2006
Posts: 394
Location: Hullgaria and Lagos
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 6:33 am Post subject: |
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| Roy Gardiner wrote: |
I'm not going to delete this thread.
- In sport, drugs must not be legalised.
- In real life, drugs must be legalised.
Good 'ere innit? |
Agree 100%. |
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IainW
E, Silver
Joined: 27 May 2003
Posts: 1996
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 7:35 am Post subject: |
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| what next? Go Ride club enlists the help of modern day Dr Josef Mengele. |
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Joursans
Div 2 Pro
Joined: 18 Jul 2006
Posts: 4840
Location: The Whole Year Inn
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 7:45 am Post subject: |
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Funnily enough a work colleague asked me the same question in the pub last night.
I have always thought free speech was a vastly overated "liberty" so rather than engage in a constructive debate on the issue I deleted him. 
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DNAse
E, Gold
Joined: 24 Feb 2006
Posts: 2414
Location: Oxfordshire
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 8:32 am Post subject: |
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I think this is certainly a valid opinion and discussion. I think there could be a case for allowing any form of doping/treatment/manipulation BUT having a set of predefined "safe" biochemical/physiological parameters (eg testosterone level, Haematocrit etc) Exceeding these levels would result in dsiqualification and suspension.
However cycling cannot act unilaterally, I think every sport needs the same frame work otherwise you would get the pro-wrestling situation where it is viewed as entertainment rather than sport.
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Festina_Lente
E, Bronze
Joined: 14 May 2007
Posts: 317
Location: Algarve
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 9:14 am Post subject: |
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What a debate!
How about neither yes or no?
I mean the d r u g s problem is unlikely to go away. Even with efficient methods, there will still be a chancer, as Vino prooved.
They are all grown men, they can make whatever dessisions they like, regarding their health. Some people choose to drink, others drive fast...
We don't mind medically enhanced celebrities and the Americans don't seem to mind medically enhanced atheletes (MLB, NBA, NFL), so why not cyclists?
Durring prohibition, the unscrupulous profited. As is happening in cycling. Allowing drinking hasn't turned everyone into an alcoholic. Aren't those that abuse these things are likely to do so anyway?
The middle ground?
How about having medical controls and monitor whether someone is fit to compete, or unfit, as can happen anyway in cycling, before even d r u g s come in to it e.g. athelete suffering septal heart defect, anemea
Thus allowing people to compete on the same terms, not handing advantage to those who do cheat, protecting an atheletes diginity and protecting the health of those who compete, beyond what anti- d o p i n g does.
It would be nice if people could just be honest though... |
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Des
Moderator
Joined: 19 Apr 2002
Posts: 16900
Location: Harrow
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 9:26 am Post subject: |
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| Festina_Lente wrote: |
What a debate!
How about neither yes or no?
I mean the d r u g s problem is unlikely to go away. Even with efficient methods, there will still be a chancer, as Vino prooved.
They are all grown men, they can make whatever dessisions they like, regarding their health. Some people choose to drink, others drive fast...
We don't mind medically enhanced celebrities and the Americans don't seem to mind medically enhanced atheletes (MLB, NBA, NFL), so why not cyclists?
Durring prohibition, the unscrupulous profited. As is happening in cycling. Allowing drinking hasn't turned everyone into an alcoholic. Aren't those that abuse these things are likely to do so anyway?
The middle ground?
How about having medical controls and monitor whether someone is fit to compete, or unfit, as can happen anyway in cycling, before even d r u g s come in to it e.g. athelete suffering septal heart defect, anemea
Thus allowing people to compete on the same terms, not handing advantage to those who do cheat, protecting an atheletes diginity and protecting the health of those who compete, beyond what anti- d o p i n g does.
It would be nice if people could just be honest though... |
At its simplest level it defraunds and disadvantages those who want to ride clean, as well as preurrising them to turn to chemical assistance in order to compete.
Re the health testing, most EU governing bodies insist on a medical certificate (including heart screening) before issuing even an amateur licence.
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clouchi
E, Silver
Joined: 08 Aug 2006
Posts: 901
Location: The Glorious South West
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 9:40 am Post subject: |
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| even with health checks, some would push too far. and riders keeling over in the tour would look even worse than a few positive tests - would you let your kids do a sport where you can and indeed have to turn to *CENSORED* to stand a chance? |
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the shadowy darkforces
E, Bronze
Joined: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 279
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 9:52 am Post subject: |
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| i dont think that the current reality is -take d r u g s or loose. Are there any facts as too how much these products improve performance |
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