Should BC sort out on-line entry?

Stuart · Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 8:34 am Post subject: Should BC sort out on-line entry?

Just out of interest would you be interested in on-line entry if it was possible and available?
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Larry Hickmott · Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 8:38 am Post subject:

... online as on the web and not on the line! Very Happy

Larry
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Rich Hill · Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 8:50 am Post subject:

OH YES!!!!!! What a GREAT idea - making it all centralised.... come on that is a step towards the future isn't it...

You could hand the whole schbang over to BC - leaving organisers free to concentrate on more important stuff like raising profile, ensuring good marshalling etc.

BC could even set up a Direct Debit out of your BA the amount for the races you enter.....

You could have an online membership account which would show you all the races you are entered in for... perhaps a bit like the VR message box.

The mind boggles...

Then you could also add the RTTC (or what ever they want to call them selves) to it - oh but no - the Yorkshire men could never agree to that could they...
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qcscmh · Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 9:32 am Post subject:

I can see many problems - like you could not organise a race if you were not online. Confused

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Animal · Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 11:33 am Post subject:

Excellent idea! It would be much easier!
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Stuart · Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 11:56 am Post subject:

CJ · Cat 1 Groupie Joined: 24 Sep 2002 Posts: 104

You'd probably just have a database of entries, maybe connected to the membership database so that entrants could just select a membership number, linking the member's details to race(s) entered. An organisers area (or public area, if you wanted to allow entrants to view other entries) could allow selection by race. This could also be linked to the race calendar database to bring up race details, results database which would automatically update the points database.....

Trust me, I'm an IT consultant Very Happy

Alan Lawrence · Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 5:15 pm Post subject:

...and how about riders who have not got computers? Confused

andy_storey_2003 · Cat 1 Groupie Joined: 29 Jan 2003 Posts: 142

This is all good stuff, but as the BCF are normally so tight with money, could we not get a group of us together to do it!

I mean, an IT cousultant (mentioned above), a web developer (me) and others would be able to specify the system and write it & implement it.

All for life membership to the BCF!!!!

Andy

elaina · Moderator Joined: 02 Jul 2002 Posts: 11199 Location: home

Looks like cycling might be moving forwards - if the BC takes this on board.

Alan Lawrence · Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 5:34 pm Post subject:

Yes agree...I'm behind the idea and as it's been mentioned it's a step forward. Howmuch would it cost though to join the BC if things went in this direction?

Glyn · Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 6:27 pm Post subject:

I agree, on line entry is the way to go. Along with on line BCF affiliaction. Its time that the BCF took over the full responsibilty of our sport. Lets do away with the Divisions and event organisers, we don't really need them, it could all be done centrally at BCF HQ. Very Happy

Richard · Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 7:09 pm Post subject:

I agree. I've just downloaded this year's entry forms off the BC and CTT sites and the latest CTT form is great. It's got space for my e-mail address like the BC one which means there are race organsers out there who e-mail forms and results off and save on time and money already. I've seen it happen in RR's last year.
All I need now is to be able to e-mail the forms to the organiser direct and somehow get the payment sorted out and we're cooking on gas.
How about if race organisers set-up a separate bank account or use their club's account and when you have a full field, just e-mail the racers with the bank details and we can all transfer the money in via our PC's or by using telephone banking.
I suppose that way you could save having to write cheques out and save the hassle of having them sent back if you had your entry returned........

Well?
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StuartBen · Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 7:29 pm Post subject:

Doing everything on-line is a wonderful theory, but only a theory at the moment. Technology is only as good as the humans operating it. Rubbish in - rubbish out. In the recent/current experience of this organiser a lot of would-be racers are illiterates in handwriting and/or technology.

Having tried to send out race information to around 70 entrants who claimed to have e-mail addresses, about 15% have been rejected by the mail servers. Two or three proved to be because I had misread their dreadful handwriting, but the rest remain a mystery - probably because they have since changed their address or their free Hotmail account automatically closed down because they had not used it for 30 days. Or the one with a college address has left the college.

So this organiser then has to send the details out by normal post on an individual basis which takes a lot of time and effort. At least those riders who had not claimed to have an e-mail could be easily catered for with mail merge labels.

If you have not yet got information on your participation in the support events for the Archer GP, then it is likely you are one of the guilty ones!

I will try to get down to it in the next day or so, but have concentrated on the main race which was done completely by Royal Mail, which is likely to be much more reliable.

We are a long way off being able to go completely on-line and, as for that guest who suggested that all races be organised centrally from one office, what asylum has he escaped from?

Willi Tarran · Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 8:17 pm Post subject:

Before we go down this road too far please answer the simple question of

"What is wrong with what we have?"

One small suggestion for Glynn " please take your toungue out of your cheek this very instant"

Stuart I agree with you, we must first get the riders t fill in forms so that we can read them

I do a lot of process simplification, that means taking OUT unneccessary or duplicate steps. Adding a level of complication makes the process more likely to fail.

I ask again
"What is wrong with what we have?"

Willi Tarran

Alan Lawrence · Posted: Sat Mar 22, 2003 12:22 am Post subject:

Agree With Willi most riders are not well where do I start???

Stuart · Posted: Sat Mar 22, 2003 9:44 am Post subject:

Just pick up on one point regarding the handwriting on forms. If the foem was on-line then a lot of error trapping could be put in with stuff like drop down menus in stead of free text. When I have design databases in the past this has always been one way of doing it. What about having all your details linked to your licence number as a primary key. Then put your licence number in to the entry form and everything else is populated on the form by the database. That way you only make one data correction rather than duplicating data.

One other point worth noting - analysts predict that cheques will be fazed out over the next 5 - 8 years so don't rely too much on erxisting payment methods.
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'What's up with her? I been hearing that she's been giving that stuff out to all them grafitti guys!' ' Yo, shut the :evil: up, Chico, man!' 'I'd paint 3 of those murals for some of that ass....'

Willi Tarran · Posted: Sat Mar 22, 2003 10:18 am Post subject:

Do not get me wrong, I have no objection to e-entry, worked with it for years at the World Masters and it worked very well. My only objection is 3rd party cash transfers which confuse the matters especially if it were routed through the BCF. These problems will be solved in the future.
Anyone can send me an e-mail with an electronic entry but I must have the money before the start.
I have been let down by a few people who ring up and say get me on the start sheet and then do not turn up leaving the race out of pocket. The solution is entry on the line or over the phone ONLY if I know AND trust the rider concerned.

I have no objection to any method of entry as long as it is both secure and dealt with on an honest basis.

Willi Tarran

Stuart Hallam · Posted: Sat Mar 22, 2003 11:01 am Post subject:

I did a whole load of work for the BC Board in December 2001/ January 2002 on the feasibility of e-entry, which I presented to the January 2002 Board meeting.

I have prepared a methodology but it cannot be implemented ahead of a database upgrade. It is planned to upgrade the BC database to a relational database (SQL Server) this year.

There is a roadmap and most of the issues on this thread have long since been considered and are on that roadmap.

A few comments;

Any future e-entry system must run in parallel with snail mail entries and allowing the organiser editing access to the event section on the portal easily caters this for.

Payments for the event are the easy bit and the e-commerce merchant would potentially become a sponsor. They are all owned by the major banks and would receive a fee for e-entries.

Stuart B's point about handwriting accuracy is very valid, but is that not an argument FOR going e-commerce. When an entrant only has to insert their licence number, everything is legible on the screen and even the spelling of their name gets onto the programme correctly.

It goes without saying that a service level agreement would be needed between BC and the organiser to ensure that money is transferred ahead of the event.

The over-subscribed event is easy to accommodate as the entry fee can be held in suspense by the merchant, pending the organiser initiating the withdrawal on acceptance.

The good news is that it is feasible and it is down to when membership as a whole feel that the board should be mandated to do it and to spend the members money to set it up.

The major beneficiaries would, in my opinion, be the organisers, who, contrary to some views on this thread, I regard as being very important people.

I would advocate making this the cheapest way of entering an event with a small premium for the snail mail entrant to compensate that poor organiser for the additional work and a punitive penalty for entrants on the day

As for the entrants, we all love convenience do we not?

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