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| Shoulfd helmet wearing be made compulsory to help prove driver liability? |
| Yes |
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18% |
[ 12 ] |
| No |
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81% |
[ 54 ] |
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| Total Votes : 66 |
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Plurien
E, Silver
Joined: 09 Dec 2003
Posts: 1966
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 Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:16 am Post subject: Wiggins says helmets should be compulsory... |
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Following an incident at around 7-30pm last night in which a london cyclist was killed by an Olympics bus carrying journalists in E London, Wiggins has said that helmets should be made compulsory. It seems this would prive that cycling has done everything it can to make cycling safe, and the rest is up to drivers and the way roads are configured.
Our thoughts are with the rider's family and friends at this time.
The driver has been arrested for a driving offence.
| Quote: |
Bradley Wiggins called for safety helmets to be made compulsory.
He said: "It's dangerous and London is a busy city and a lot of traffic. I think we have to help ourselves sometimes.
"Cycling is a dangerous sport. I know there are a lot of people out there who ride bikes who abide by everything, the laws the lights and things.
"But there are a lot of cyclists as well who don't help themselves, riding along with no helmets on, iPods on, this, that and the other on those Bojo things.
"There's got to be laws that protect both parties. Things like legalising helmets, making them the law to wear. They shouldn't be riding along with phones and iPods on, shouldn't be riding without lights."
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http://news.sky.com/story/967839/cyclist-killed-after-being-hit-by-olympic-bus
Discuss....
...puts on classic Tommy tim helmet...
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Hans Datdodishes
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:27 am Post subject: |
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Wearing a helmet never killed anyone. Compulsion is commonsense, but probably wouldn't have made any difference to last nights outcome
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Steve McGinty
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:29 am Post subject: |
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| Hans Datdodishes wrote: |
| Wearing a helmet never killed anyone. Compulsion is commonsense, but probably wouldn't have made any difference to last nights outcome |
Yep - lock the thread...
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ColT
E, Gold
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StuartBen
E, Silver
Joined: 21 Oct 2002
Posts: 1825
Location: West London
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 10:22 am Post subject: |
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While there can be no greater fan of Bradley as a rider and personality than myself, it is not quite that simple.
What I have observed this year, having been fortunate enough to visit three cities, is that in Melbourne the publicly available bikes were hardly used, but in Paris and London they are heavily used. The difference is that in Melbourne you have to wear a helmet, which is compulsory across Australia, and the public are not prepared to carry one in case they feel the need to use a bike on the spur of the moment or to be lumbered with it on a visit to a shop.
So the use of these bikes is considerably limited. Perhaps the more general use of bikes is not so much limited by the compulsory use of helmets, but it can be a limiting factor.
Incidentally, the Australian police tend to be much more strict on road regulations than our own. (  ) |
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ColT
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Straff
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London Bus Chaser
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Joined: 15 Jan 2007
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:16 am Post subject: |
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David Mclean
E, Bronze
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Chrissylaa
E, Gold
Joined: 17 Apr 2009
Posts: 3382
Location: On a hillside desolate.
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:18 am Post subject: |
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Instead of helmets lets encase ourselves in metal and glass and rubber,we could even add a motor to save doing any pedalling which will save knee injuries etc.
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Hans Datdodishes
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:34 am Post subject: |
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And to counter that..
http://theconversation.edu.au/dont-be-fooled-keeping-bike-helmets-is-best-for-health-661
there's plenty of statistics that can be chucked out for both sides of the argument, and both camps are pretty much entrenched in their views and unlikely to change. Personally I can't see a reason (1) not to wear one and can't see a massive problem if (2) it was made compulsory to wear them. The reasons for compulsion are safety based, the reasons against are liberty based (generally speaking).
I've had a night in hospital and 13 stitches thanks to a header at speed on Harvey Haddon velodrome - doctor said the helmet saved my eye (?) and possibly life. How would he know? - in all probability he doesn't, but I'm sure I'd have done more damage without one on, so that convinced me.
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Steve DT
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:49 am Post subject: |
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OP: how can wearing a helmet prove liability? It can't.
I vaguely recall another case where a judge had concluded that by the rider not wearing a helmet there was a case of contributory negligence against him.
It's a messy old debate & will probably have legs on it forever, however common sense should sort of kick in anyway. Helmets are so light & comport able these days you hardly know you're wearing one. For anyone still labouring the liberty argument then just think a bit harder about it while you're still able to. |
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David Mclean
E, Bronze
Joined: 16 Apr 2004
Posts: 255
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Hans Datdodishes wrote: |
And to counter that..
http://theconversation.edu.au/dont-be-fooled-keeping-bike-helmets-is-best-for-health-661
there's plenty of statistics that can be chucked out for both sides of the argument, and both camps are pretty much entrenched in their views and unlikely to change. Personally I can't see a reason (1) not to wear one and can't see a massive problem if (2) it was made compulsory to wear them. The reasons for compulsion are safety based, the reasons against are liberty based (generally speaking).
I've had a night in hospital and 13 stitches thanks to a header at speed on Harvey Haddon velodrome - doctor said the helmet saved my eye (?) and possibly life. How would he know? - in all probability he doesn't, but I'm sure I'd have done more damage without one on, so that convinced me. |
I just read that article, I also read the comments underneath, too. no one has picked a hole in De Jong's paper yet so far as I know.
You are right: there's no need to have this debate again, it's already happened a million times and got nowhere, it's a slight "deck chairs on the titanic" scenario, too. I wear a helmet myself, it's very slightly safer and it doesn't stop me riding. I remain pro choice though.
Wiggins restarted the helmet debate, Vino restarted the radio debate...
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Hans Datdodishes
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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I'd be more pro choice if the people who chose not to wear a helmet had private health cover
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David Mclean
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Hans Datdodishes wrote: |
| I'd be more pro choice if the people who chose not to wear a helmet had private health cover |
This debate is predictable.
At this point I'm supposed to make a comparison with pedestrians wearing helmets.
Let's just assume that I have.
Your turn.
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Hans Datdodishes
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:28 pm Post subject: |
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| David Mclean wrote: |
| Hans Datdodishes wrote: |
| I'd be more pro choice if the people who chose not to wear a helmet had private health cover |
This debate is predictable.
At this point I'm supposed to make a comparison with pedestrians wearing helmets.
Let's just assume that I have.
Your turn. |
I usually quote Darwin at this stage
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David Mclean
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:31 pm Post subject: |
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Excellent.
For your tax thing I was gonna do a kind-of "bigger picture" cost of healthcare thing and also refer to the film [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan's_Run_(film)]Logan's Run[/url].
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Hans Datdodishes
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:36 pm Post subject: |
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| David Mclean wrote: |
Excellent.
For your tax thing I was gonna do a kind-of "bigger picture" cost of healthcare thing and also refer to the film [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan's_Run_(film)]Logan's Run[/url]. |
If Tucker was still here he'd put up his EXCELLENT fridge analogy. He's currently baiting the unwary on Facebook
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David Mclean
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Hans Datdodishes wrote: |
| David Mclean wrote: |
Excellent.
For your tax thing I was gonna do a kind-of "bigger picture" cost of healthcare thing and also refer to the film [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan's_Run_(film)]Logan's Run[/url]. |
If Tucker was still here he'd put up his EXCELLENT fridge analogy. He's currently baiting the unwary on Facebook |
That's a shame because I'm running out of stuff to say really.
You made a mistake earlier by the way, you should've said that your helmet definitely saved your eye - and life. Then we could've had a frankly brilliant debate about the merits of anecdotal evidence.
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Hans Datdodishes
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 1:09 pm Post subject: |
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| David Mclean wrote: |
| Hans Datdodishes wrote: |
| David Mclean wrote: |
Excellent.
For your tax thing I was gonna do a kind-of "bigger picture" cost of healthcare thing and also refer to the film [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan's_Run_(film)]Logan's Run[/url]. |
If Tucker was still here he'd put up his EXCELLENT fridge analogy. He's currently baiting the unwary on Facebook |
That's a shame because I'm running out of stuff to say really.
You made a mistake earlier by the way, you should've said that your helmet definitely saved your eye - and life. Then we could've had a frankly brilliant debate about the merits of anecdotal evidence. |
Frankly I think the doctor was talking  , but I probably would have had a couple more stitches. Who knows.
In summary, yes to compulsory helmets, no to dual carriageway time trials, and Shimano
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